Re: ARMORED CORE V patch 1.02 and 1.03

 by TaranTatsuuchi » Sun Apr 22, 2012 3:26 pm

Pash Master wrote:What you really should be doing is contacting FromSoft, they'll definately be able to tell you more about what the status is with any patches inbound for NA / EU regions. Namco was just the publisher in this case, FromSoft would have a lot more answers for you guys.

Hope this helps you guys out

I do believe there have already been queries toward FromSoft about these issues... And here's the responce that was reported from From's facebook page...

Answering to the questions (overseas version)

Thank you for your questions about our company’s game title, ARMORED CORE V, and also a great thanks for your patronage to our product.

We cannot answer to the particular questions of the overseas version (such as server and patches) of ARMORED CORE V,
since NAMCO BANDAI Games Inc. is in charge of the sales abroad.
We are very sorry, but please contact NAMCO BANDAI Games Inc.
Also, please let them know your region and platform as well.

We are truly sorry for the inconvenience.
We hope you will understand.

Thank you
FromSoftware

I hope this doesn't devolve into a 'finger pointing' scenario where each party is saying to consult the other :/

Re: ARMORED CORE V patch 1.02 and 1.03

 by Pash Master » Sun Apr 22, 2012 3:35 pm

TaranTatsuuchi wrote:I do believe there have already been queries toward FromSoft about these issues... And here's the responce that was reported from From's facebook page...

Answering to the questions (overseas version)

Thank you for your questions about our company’s game title, ARMORED CORE V, and also a great thanks for your patronage to our product.

We cannot answer to the particular questions of the overseas version (such as server and patches) of ARMORED CORE V,
since NAMCO BANDAI Games Inc. is in charge of the sales abroad.
We are very sorry, but please contact NAMCO BANDAI Games Inc.
Also, please let them know your region and platform as well.

We are truly sorry for the inconvenience.
We hope you will understand.

Thank you
FromSoftware

I hope this doesn't devolve into a 'finger pointing' scenario where each party is saying to consult the other :/

Ouch, hopefully not. From the post it seems they're running on Namco-owned servers in the US and Europe, but it's weird thought because -- and I'm just guessing, I don't know the full details -- but couldn't FromSoft theoretically make any adjustments that you guys are asking for (which from what I read from the other threads, is already made and released in Japan) and pass over the patch to Namco to then distribute over the NA and EU regions without any problems? Dunno where all this delay is coming from then... Wow is this confusing!

Well either way, I'd reccomend you to try and contact Filtherich over on Twitter (http://www.twitter.com/filthierich). He's a Namco CM and answers a few questions on Twitter, hopefully he can take a look and shed more light on this.

Hope you guys get the answers your looking for.

Re: ARMORED CORE V patch 1.02 and 1.03

 by DemonicArc » Sun Apr 22, 2012 5:39 pm

it takes time to role it out compared to how updates work on PCs where no certification is required.

News to me bro, because every other company rolls out patches either in parallel or a couple days apart, Sony must really hate bamco since the process is taking this long, oh wait, its just bamco being lazy, you can justify it as a process until cows come home, but unlike you with moderation, sony is paid to slap certs on files, and they sure as **** wouldn't be in business as long as they did if they half assed it, for one, and another thing being, if an indie company can get a patch certified in a matter of days, a big profile company should be able to in hours, like i said, this is just bamco showing plain disregard for their costumers, plain and simple, I take it you were aware their costumer service was even instructed to lie to us that v01 patch NA is v03 patch JP just because they didn't feel like looking for a proper solution to the problem, that doesn't inspire much faith, and Its a slippery slope from there.

Re: ARMORED CORE V patch 1.02 and 1.03

 by Pash Master » Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:02 am

DemonicArc wrote:News to me bro, because every other company rolls out patches either in parallel or a couple days apart, Sony must really hate bamco since the process is taking this long, oh wait, its just bamco being lazy, you can justify it as a process until cows come home, but unlike you with moderation, sony is paid to slap certs on files, and they sure as **** wouldn't be in business as long as they did if they half assed it, for one, and another thing being, if an indie company can get a patch certified in a matter of days, a big profile company should be able to in hours, like i said, this is just bamco showing plain disregard for their costumers, plain and simple, I take it you were aware their costumer service was even instructed to lie to us that v01 patch NA is v03 patch JP just because they didn't feel like looking for a proper solution to the problem, that doesn't inspire much faith, and Its a slippery slope from there.

Actually, its the same for every company. On the PC, there is no body you have to go through to release it. As soon as a patch is finished, it goes live straight away. On the consoles, they have to go through Microsoft and Sony and be certified before release. It's not Sony being lazy, these things actually do take time. Armored Core isn't the only game sending a patch in, think of every other games out there that are sending things in for certification at the same time. It becomes a longer process, something that is impossible to do in a matter of hours. I don't know who told you a console-company can pump one out in a matter of hours, but their sources are incorrect.

The certification process isn't just looking at the patch and saying, Sure, that works let's send it through. They do a multitude of testing on it to make sure there isn't any unintended results on the console. One such example is a few years back, an Xbox LIVE Arcade game had unintentionally made it possible to download free paid games from the service. These are things like this that they check for and test while certifying a product. They don't just push it straight through once they get a patch in from a developer or publisher.

You also said Sony wouldn't be in business if it wasn't for the certifications they do, which is also incorrect. Game certifications are by far their main source of income -- They get much more income from system sales and Game sales. Everytime you buy a game, Sony get's 12 bucks from that. Now imagine how many games are sold with big sellers like Call of Duty, and multiply those sales by 12. That's a lot, much more than the price of getting a patch certified. Same thing with digital purchases, they recieve 30% of all the sales from any software items on their store, be it first part or third party.

Another thing I want to quote you on is the indie devs releasing patchs quicker. That's in fact the entire opposite on console, it's much harder and an even longer process to release patches for XBLIG, which is why you barely see any at all. You have to jumps through many hoops to release one, not even talking about the price tag involved for indie devs to release a patch to them. You'll only ever see faster patch releases from PCs, because they're open ended. Even Steam is much more open ended, which is why it's more popular than Xbox LIVE and PSN for indie devs.


This hopefully gives you a better insight of how things work behind the scenes. Your view from your previous post was very clouded and inconsistant, so hope this clears things up a little. The game hasn't been out that long in the US and Europe, so assuming Namco submitted the patch late, it might still be in certification. News from Namco or anybody confirming the status on a patch sure would be welcomed instead of being kept in the dark like this, but until then just keep trying to reach somebody and keep an eye on the game. Did you have any chances with the community manager I pointed you to?

Re: ARMORED CORE V patch 1.02 and 1.03

 by Goat » Mon Apr 23, 2012 3:11 pm

IIRC Mechaverse has done so already, but that was a long time ago. I'd prolly just go ask them, but with the lack of updates from most of the AC communities, I don't think anything else has happened so far.

Anyway, most of us are pretty much asking stuff about ACV because it feels like an incomplete game to play, and at one point multiplayer conquest almost died completely due to the lack of updates. Being left out in the dark is what we're really concerned at, because it's been already around for a month now and there hasn't been any answer related to the patch. Not to mention From Software and Namdai had an agreement of their responsibility outside Japan, so they should be getting the stuff from From Software instead.

So yeah, we'll keep reminding Namdai until it gives us a straight answer of yes or no. Or at least, anything different from the usual 'we have no news regarding ACV' sort of thing, because it is up to them in the end.

Re: ARMORED CORE V patch 1.02 and 1.03

 by Thryfe » Tue Apr 24, 2012 8:13 am

Goat wrote:IIRC Mechaverse has done so already, but that was a long time ago. I'd prolly just go ask them, but with the lack of updates from most of the AC communities, I don't think anything else has happened so far.

Anyway, most of us are pretty much asking stuff about ACV because it feels like an incomplete game to play, and at one point multiplayer conquest almost died completely due to the lack of updates. Being left out in the dark is what we're really concerned at, because it's been already around for a month now and there hasn't been any answer related to the patch. Not to mention From Software and Namdai had an agreement of their responsibility outside Japan, so they should be getting the stuff from From Software instead.

So yeah, we'll keep reminding Namdai until it gives us a straight answer of yes or no. Or at least, anything different from the usual 'we have no news regarding ACV' sort of thing, because it is up to them in the end.

Ya, it sorta feels like were being forgotten. not exactly the best thing to do to customers.

Re: ARMORED CORE V patch 1.02 and 1.03

 by MeChaNiZ3D » Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:23 am

I hope you'll excuse me for not reading all the posts so far, but I have given it a quick read and I cannot find anywhere something which explains why we (EU and US, etc.) do not have patches that were developed easily over a month ago, and implemented in Japan without issue. I understand that patches must be certified for the rest of the world, but it has been far too long for this to be the only reason we don't have them. I cannot stress enough how important these patches are for the multiplayer portion of ACV.

Re: ARMORED CORE V patch 1.02 and 1.03

 by Thatamos » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:00 am

MeChaNiZ3D wrote:It's two pages of information, minuscule compared to what you've read on Mechaverse. Read it.

Something that's gone unmentioned is the blatant lack of PR done by either From SOFTWARE or Bamco. Understandably, the majority of Armored Core's fan base is Japan-based. However, the game has been ported overseas since it's inception in 1997, and has developed a customer base since then. This is a fact not up for debate, as the game has been continuously ported to the US ever since, thought I'm unsure about the EU. Regardless, these markets exist, and are obviously important to FROM Software to some degree. Otherwise, the ports would cease, and Armored Core would be a niche of the past.

But that's not the case, is it? AC:V was released in the U.S. a month ago, with the promises of a functioning multiplayer w/ boss content (something advertised on the back of the CD cover). Many of us within the AC:V community bought the game with the assumption that these promises will be fullfilled, as would any consumer when deciding to buy a product based on the information at hand.

Yet we're getting bosses, FINALLY, only just this weekend. We've received no official news from Bamco or FROM regarding any patch information, the decaying quality of servers within the multiplayer (rampant with unwarranted DC's, random yet not-so-random occurrences of AC:V simply shutting off while transitioning into a game, or the absurd in-game mechanic that forces a lobby of 8-10 people to restart an entire fight b/c one individual decided to leave to avoid waiting for the round to finish), or the need of a better match-making system to revitalize the Conquest system in US / EU regions. All of this could be ignored and looked at as momentary grievances while FROM Software works diligently to fix these problems-- but that's just it. None of that has happened! With zero announcements addressing any issues at all, with all the phone calls and customer service chats individuals have had to force from either company, or the blatant disregard for an entire player-body aside from those in Japan, leaves many loyal fans to wonder, "Do you guys even really give a ****?"

And as someone who paid $60 for a game I assumed would perform based upon the promises made on it's goddamn cover, I feel the aforementioned question is of high importance. Yet I have little to no faith it'll ever be answered adequately, e.g. with a public statement addressing the many issues the AC:V community has brought forward to Bamco / FROM.

To say "We're swamped and can't deal with it" is an absurdly inadequate answer for companies who rely upon consumers to buy their product. And don't assume that's not what's being said here-- we live in the internet age. It can take anywhere from 20 minutes to 2 hours to prepare a statement that could address all these issues. Sometimes even a few days. But even if it took a couple days, it's been a f***ing month.

No excuses. We want results, like an announcement from either party that clarifies this mist we've been forced to wade through. Not (though always useful!) unpaid moderators trying to piece together what's wrong. Not third-party organizations trying to quell the masses. Not indifference-- we want to be acknowledged, damnit!


P.S. -- If we're to follow patterns laid out by FROM's / Bamco's previous game (Dark Souls), they'll work on patches and go through this certification process that's been mentioned in the thread, and make a public announcement that patches are coming THE DAY BEFORE THE PATCHES ARE RELEASED. Which is a ridiculous strategy, one that needs no repetition. Talk to your consumers, let them know you're not ignoring them, and stop forcing them to appeal to you on forums, phone calls, and chat rooms. That's inexcusably poor public relations, and yes, both parties should be ashamed of it.

Re: ARMORED CORE V patch 1.02 and 1.03

 by TaranTatsuuchi » Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:22 pm

Well, it appears Rich tweeted news about the bosses...

But replied to a followup about the patches, that he had no more news about ACV... :/

Re: ARMORED CORE V patch 1.02 and 1.03

 by TwinSkies » Sat Apr 28, 2012 2:28 am

Thank you for explaining the process, Pash.

Still, I cannot help but feel shortchanged - I paid good money for a game that I assumed that I could enjoy with my friends both here in the Philippines and in the United States. Sure, ACV's fun, but every time some player jumps into a team battle, and hoses everybody down with a pair of (pre-patch) broken weapons, I cannot help but look at Japan's servers, and realize that WE should also be getting these re-balances too. Patches that could have made the game enjoyable for people who want to play around with more AC builds, instead of the staples that revolve around just a handful of broken, overpowered parts.

And frankly, releasing the boss battles sans the patches just felt like a half-baked attempt by Bamco to appease its fanbase. To say we were disappointed would be putting it nicely.

There is a lot more I wish I could say here, and about how I feel I've been cheated into buying a partly-finished product, but I think the mods are under enough stress as it is.